"Disable waiting for pre-jump and landing" setting not working
tracked
Kerry Kas
In Pony Play we have something called "Quick Jump" this is where you put a tick in the setting "Preferences > Move & View > Movement > Disable waiting for pre-jump and landing". As a ponygirl this is absolutely banned. However, I see the quick jump motion from time to time even though I don't have this option ticked. It usually happens if I'm doing a series of jumps in a row.
This occasional missing of the prejump and landing animations can be seen in SL Viewer, FireStorm viewer Kokua viewer and Alchemy viewer.
I see it least often when using the SL official viewer, however the fact that this occurrs in all viewers suggests it is a bug in the under lying code.
Observations in the Pony community suggests that this has got much more worse since the PBR update.
The time when it is seen is when you hold the jump key to do a series of jumps.
This bug has also been reported in Firestorm:
Videos have been made of the motion:
Not working as expected
Now working as expected
No change in preference were made during this test.
Video recorded using Firestorm 7.1.9.74746
I repeat the same motion can be seeing using SL Viewer, Alchemy Viewer and Kokua Viewer.
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Maxie Rizzo
I did some testing on my own. Not sure if this will help or not, but here you go. To be clear, this is not the super jump that has been mentioned elsewhere. These are examples of my avatar not playing my landing, pre-jump, or jump animations, effectively ignoring the "Disable waiting for pre-jump" check box, whilst still jumping to the standard height.
That video is of me jumping in pony gear with my AO disabled on land I own in the Priasmin region. I chose that section because it's fairly flat, there are no prims that would interfere, and it's the actual ground. You can see that I show the "Disable waiting for pre jump" box is unchecked. I then start jumping, holding my jump key down. The quick jump issue happens at 15, 23, 25, 27, 33, and 35 seconds.
There I perform the same jumping route, but now as a human AV. The result is the same. I perform the jump testing both with my AO disabled and enabled. The issue presents throughout the video.
This video is of me in pony gear, with my AO disabled, jumping in place. No lateral movement. The issue can be seen while I am jumping in place at 15 and 17 seconds.
While testing this, I did find something interesting. I went to an old region that I used to own a while back called Minacci. These days it's almost entirely abandoned. I was looking for somewhere that had as little sim load as possible. At http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Minacci/94/194/145 there is a long completely flat section where I tried jumping. Back and forth along that flat area, for 400 consecutive jumps(roughly 10 minutes), I was not able to get my avatar to quick jump. However, the very first jump that landed away from that completely flat area caused my avatar to quick jump. I tested it repeatedly over another 20 minutes. While on the completely flat ground, my avatar did not experience any jumping issues. It wasn't until I left the flat area that I started to experience the problem.
Atlas Linden
tracked
It seems the pre-jump that sometimes occurs is what causes the super jumps. Enabling the Pony-community-banned setting "Disable waiting for pre-jump and landing animations" on Firestorm and jumping twice on an object while holding down the jump button causes an immediate repro of the super jump.
A new GitHub issue has been made in regards to the occasional lack of a pre-jump: https://github.com/secondlife/viewer/issues/4218
This issue is now being set to Tracked.
dantia Gothly
Atlas Linden The super jump has been around for over a decade and before the option to disable prejump and landing animation, you also do not need to disable prejump or landing in order to do a super jump, simply jumping off the edge of a prim will cause a super jump. This has been known in the SLMC community for over a decade and at this point has become a feature.
Atlas Linden
To clarify my comment, the super jump I'm referring to is not related to the jumping near the edge of a prim which yes has been around for a long time. This super jump mentioned can occur while jumping on the middle of a large flat prim but it seems to only happen when the pre-jump doesn't trigger.
I haven't been able to reproduce the missing pre-jump issue on viewers older than 7.1.6 (labelled as Maintenance YZ) so it does appear a difference was made around this time.
Atlas Linden
Thanks for the extra info all! It appears that the super jump is strictly occurring on objects (rather than terrain) which is exactly what the Bulgogi region uses for the aforementioned courses.
A new GitHub issue in regards to the super jump been made for this here: https://github.com/secondlife/viewer/issues/4217
Further investigation is still underway in regards to the pre-jump and landing animation issues.
Kerry Kas
Thank you Dan Linden, Atlas Linden and Whirly Fizzle for taking the time to visit us at Bulgogi today. I was very proud to show you around our sim and demonstrate our bug to you.
Happy hunting and sending you virtual bug spray.
Let us know if the Pony Community can be of further assistance.
Kindest regards
Barley Sugar.
Tashia Redrose
Despite some earlier commenters saying that the AO is the cause. I have tested with and without AO, with and without scripted or built in AO. No difference, the bug still occurs. The pre-jump animation simply does not play sometimes, or it is playing, but it isnt blocking the jump as it should.
EDIT: Yes. I know with AO, and with a custom pre-jump animation, this bug is significantly worse, and more noticeable. In my tests, i usually do not use a custom pre-jump animation. Due to a bug that has existed long before the one we are referring to here.
Dan Linden
Hello Kerry,
Can you provide some test content for this jumping issue, or point me to the exact content needed?
Thank you.
prissypaw Aldrin
Dan Linden dunno how you feel about visiting bdsm comunity locations, easiest way to test these bugs your self is go to a ponyplay sim location and do the jumping courses, alternatively try jumping around a sim and pay attention to how the jump is different some times than others, the double jump(super jump) issue i have come across since the move to amazon is possibly related as it seems when it hapens prejump is skipped, this happens when you consecutive jumps and the random factor is noticable when you are also moving while jumping.
Dan Linden
prissypaw Aldrin: I need a simple recipe to reproduce the bug. I'll need the test content to reproduce the bug on my machine and then I'll hand that content off to a developer to reproduce it on their machine. I'm looking for something like 1) Get item x and wear it. 2) Make a 50m platform to walk on. 3) Tap the jump button. Observed: This behavior. Expected That behavior. I do see the observed and expected behavior in the videos (those are very helpful!), and now I need the test content.
Ralna Payne
Dan Linden : best visit a pony sim and try out a racing track - steeple and try to jump over the hurdles, try to jump on the edge of a mountain etc - you will find out, you jump a few times regulary - and then you will get bumped up - like when you use quickjump.
prissypaw Aldrin
Dan Linden its not an issue of a scripted object or the viewer's specificaly it is an issue of somthing relating to the change from "Bare metal" to "Cloud" servers and affects the jump animation, the people under this section noticed that prejump is not playing even when the quick jump setting in firestorm is disabled, this happens on all viewers i have tried, coolvl,firestorm,kokua,singularity and the sl Default viewer, the being launched up is what is known as a double jump and used to be rare but now it happens any time you do sustained jumping like on a course at a pony sim.
so
1) pick a viewer
2) go to a ponyplay sim and run a jumping course
3) notice how prejump fails to activate some times
4) take note of the double jump problem which launches you higher than a standard jump.
5) try different ao's and realize that its not the ao.
6) try no ao and realize it will do it witht hat to.
7) fix the code on server side relating to prejump animation timing that is in conflict with network changes due to moving from bare metal servers.
Maxie Rizzo
Dan Linden You need to be on a PBR viewer for it. Stand in place. Disable your AO. As Kerry stated, make sure the setting "Preferences > Move & View > Movement > Disable waiting for pre-jump and landing" is unchecked. Press and hold the jump button on your keyboard. Keep it held down. Eventually, your avatar will do one of two things: 1: What we call double jump where your avatar will jump far higher than you'd otherwise be capable of. 2: Your avatar at will do what we call quick jump where your avatar will jump without waiting for the pre-jump animation. In the procedure I detailed above, your avatar will not play the landing, pre-jump, or jump animations, it will jump immediately upon landing.
Kerry Kas
Hello Dan Linden, Thank you for taking the time to look at our bug report. I'm sorry it's taken me a couple of hours to get back to you, but I had problems with my email address and only got told of your involvement when I logged in this evening.
This bug has made a huge impact on the Pony Play community. We rely on reliable jumping and the only way we have been able to maintain our courses and training is to stick with a pre PBR viewer.
So the facts as we have been able to establish them
- There has always been a very very rare low lying issue with the prejump not working. However, at the pre PBR level is was acceptable.
- Since PBR the random Mega Jump (Double Jump) and missed prejump has become significantly worse, so much so that our training programmes and courses can not be conducted on a PBR viewer.
- When jumping, using a PBR viewer, you will randomly experience a Mega Jump (Double Jump) where you do a second jump at the zenith of the first jump or a quick jump where the prejump and landing animations are completely missed and you launch into a new jump the instant you hit the ground.
- It has been suggested that this is due to the change in the poling frequency of the movement. We can not prove or disprove this suggestions.
- It occurs in all versions of PBR viewers (some worse than others)
- It occurs in all operating systems (Mac, Windoze and Linux)
- The best way to experience this is simply to hold down the jump button and jump repeatedly. There are dozens of PonyGirls willing to demonstrate this to you or your colleagues should you wish to vist a Pony Play community.
You can see the bug demonstrated in the above youtube videos
If you would like to visit Frilly Filly Farm (On Bulgogi) sometime I would be happy to demonstrate the bug to you. Please let me know if and when would be convenient to you.
Dan Linden
open
Maxie Rizzo
I've begun to notice that avatar jumping issues have crept into the pre PBR viewer as well. Not quick jump, per se, but quicker jump. I've noticed that my avatar will sometimes jump before the landing and pre-jump animations have finished. This is using the default SL jump and pre-jump animations. The issue is repeatable and I started noticing it approximately a month or so back. The issue is not present if my avatar jumps in place, only when my avatar is otherwise in motion as in a pony play steeple event. In a test earlier this week, I was able to see the issue about one in every 10 jumps.
Skyler Pancake
Had to log on to a viewer that hasn't been updated in over a year and likely has security bugs to partake in an event today that required repeated jumping. Add in other issues with the location... Let's just say I'm pretty frustrated at the moment. Wasted a good bit of my time just familiarizing myself with a new(to me) and outdated viewer because of a bug that's existed for what sounds like over a decade.
Kerry Kas
Skyler Pancake yes there has been some quick jump bug for that long, but it's never been a real issue until viewer 7. Now it's a REAL bug and no one is taking it seriously.
Kerry Kas
NEW INFORMATION
During further testing with Careless Whisper from the FS community, it has been found that the problem is linked to the AO.
The problem vanishes if you remove all scripted items and AO's. This is not a work around, unless we want a world filled with "duck waddling" Ruths, but it is an important discovery. This should help some techie to track down the thing that has changed.
Tashia Redrose
Kerry Kas Hey. So this is incorrect. You and the FS team are likely referencing a pre-existing bug. A bug has existed for years with custom pre-jump animations, where using a stock AO was and still is a very bad idea. If you test with a stock AO that has a pre-jump override on a pre-PBR viewer, you'll notice pre-jump sometimes gets skipped or sometimes, that animation plays a bit too long. Removing it and using the default LL pre-jump anim instead solved that problem.
There appears to be two bugs in play here. One with using a custom pre-jump animation in a AO, and one where pre-jump just happens 50% of the time regardless of settings. The first bug makes the issue a bit worse in post-PBR viewers.
Tashia Redrose
Kerry Kas Here's a few of the old JIRA bugs. Which are what i referenced for the AO based prejump bug. I am not sure where the original is, as some of these were duplicates of that one, which was filed around the 2009-2012 timeframe. But these detail what i was referring to anyhow.
EDIT: Found the original.
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