Re open Welcome Hub to all
Saz Ninetails
Limiting to mentors and those new to SL is liable to make more not stay. How it was until recently is they could benefit from meeting a wide range of well established citizens. It has always been down to more experienced people to help the new residents. Philip Linden has been there and speaking to a lot of us and now we are not welcome in the "welcome hub".
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Ebony Rabbit
Nah. They just need to rename it the Unwelcome Hub. And rename the Social Plaza the Antisocial Plaza.
Midnoot Resident
Ebony Rabbit It was only social in the beginning , before the usual power trippers caught on and signed up to become mentors , before the usual vigilantes who volunteer in all the other sims, caught on and brought the same problems with them, etc... But for some reason, LL refuses to catch onto who these people are and continues to allow them to weasel into every single group that's supposed to be welcoming and helpful, until they eventually become THE face of SL; a very antisocial, unwelcoming, noob deterring face at that.
But it's not because of this lazy bandaid fix they've come up with recently, which is the mass exile of oldbies. That's not even what made it unwelcoming, in fact, it may be the only solution to the damage that the residents themselves have done/
Deb Mercury
waits until the hub gets fumigated and the the problems removed as per LL i am beginning to understand things more clearly so i will just wait and see how it comes to fruition . but my thoughts are with all SL users whatever your motives and reasons we are real people with real feels and same with mentors, moles and actual linden labs staff. so the accusations got to stop .
Randy Pole
I expect the decision was taken in order to make the new resident experience safer. Some older residents prey upon the new and making a safe place is good.
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Nya Jules
I can only imagine that it's something temporary. I haven't been a regular there so my best guess is that it's been due to drama. Hope it gets resolved quickly. Drama causers should be handled accordingly but that should not impact friendly and respectful users who want to help out.
Midnoot Resident
Nya Jules Drama most likely caused by the stagnated pool of regulars who've chosen to make welcome hub their home and take it apon themselves to be the unspoken police of SL? Sounds about right . If only there was something we could do to ensure that drama filled, socialite, opportunists who seek power and control , were unable to get what they want . Oh wait .. lol. This is the solution; barring the access of their accounts from the welcome hub . Best it's gonna get .
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Nya Jules
Midnoot Resident
I understand that this place is prone to drama from several sources.
1) residents going there and thinking they know everything better and that their way to introduce newbies is the only right one
2) residents who think that they're creating fun but are unable to see that it's not fun for others
3) residents with a lack of social awareness who have a higher risk of conflicting with a newbie
4) residents preying on newbies with questionable intentions
All those are "natural" sources of drama. 4) can't be helped by locking the sim. People will always prey on newbies on new accounts and it's a moderation case. As for the others, those also need to be moderated. If Linden says this is too hard to moderate, well, then that sucks.
For a newbie it's just important to meet real people at the start who they can talk to if they got questions. This means in most cases: They see somebody in the game, they know what SL is kinda about, according to that person, and they know what they can do next / where they can go next. I don't share your opinion about the "risk of wrong indoctrination" or how you would call it. Everyone thinks about SL in a different way, but everyone (or most lol) in a positive way, otherwise they weren't here. I'd even argue that it's a good thing to have rather many people there than a few, to broaden that range.
I also believe that generalizing is a very bad idea. "all mentors use copy&pasted messaged, they suck!", "everyone going there seeks power and wants to abuse newbies!" Nopes.
In the end to me it would also be fine if the sim was locked but there's a clear path to a community area, the sim currently just isn't build like that, as somebody in this thread had already mentioned.
That all said these are just the normal issues that I see at a place like that, no clue what really caused the sim to get locked.
Midnoot Resident
Nya JulesThese are just normal issues, but the moderation never has been and never will be willing to weed out the truly malicious or truly detrimental from the beneficial and innocent users. It always results in a hard punishment for everyone when it comes to LL, because they absolutely refuse to moderate properly.
And what I mean by that is, they've tried, they gave basically random citizens of SL the right to be the 'helpers' and those people made users at WH feel so unwelcome that it became hot topics in the forums often, and many came foward with their stories of mistreatment by 'official helpers'. So not only do they refuse to moderate it properly, but there is no screening process it seems, as almost anyone who asks seems to become a helper... It's only months later, after they've done plenty of damage that they finally get removed from the mentor program.
And then they make the mistake of granting these privileges to people so very undeserving, people who, many of us watch from the sidelines of the community and shake our heads as we see them doing wrong to others in so many ways.. YET , because they're very present, and possibly very helpful in SOME ways, all of the negative things they do , seems to be overlooked... Until it starts gaining traction on the community in a few months , when enough people complain about the same people being very 'unprofessional' towards them, and the cycle repeats.
ChrisKozlov Resident
Think about it again! Ostracizing citizens is not fair!
Midnoot Resident
ChrisKozlov Resident Is it ostracizing? Or is it protecting the face of SL from the stain that it has become? Imagine you were a noob who just entered SL and the first thing you see is a gang of HOA like housewives named Karen who want SL THEIR way or no way, and will in fact, ironically, ostracize YOU, the newbie, if you didn't come to SL to play the game THEIR way.
This is basically what I witness often at the welcome hub over the last 2 years, after the only people left hanging out there, were the HOA group of housewives with a vendetta against fun. They're basically sucking the fun out of SL by making it far too serious, and you can bet most gen Z newbies coming into SL don't wanna hear that. It should be a fun and welcoming experience. Not a constant reminder that Karens are amongst us and that we have to obey them.
At this point, LL is absolutely making the right decision to keep newbies from being dropped directly into the Soccer mom book club PTA meeting/HOA association of anti-fun.
ChrisKozlov Resident
Midnoot Resident What I've experienced in the Infohub so far has not been negative and I haven't seen any “Karens” spoiling the fun here.
Peewee Musytari
I agree with the idea of a separate area, sounds like when I started and we had Orientation Island, where you landed, did a few basics like how to walk & talk etc it was short & to the point & then, at the end of the path, you were moved on to Help Island, where there were other people, freebie store, lots more info etc
That could work well with the current WH sims, Orientation could even be up in the sky away from everyone else or another sim somewhere & then after the basics they arrive, like now, at the social plaza, with mentors & greeters & all the great info there.
The WH was not designed to have that central sim locked off, half of the Community Exhibition is now unavailable, the touring system is all messed up & I met a 23 day old newcomer in there trying to walk around & hitting the invisible wall, totally confused.... Its just not right.
Saz Ninetails
Peewee Musytariwow 23 days old is awfully new to be locked out. Also if you try to tp in it says go to the welcome island public but no redirection and if you search it doesnt appear in search.
Lilith Carstensz
I fully support this cause, and I send a hug to everyone affected by this decision. I know many users who genuinely support it and help make this place more pleasant.
Midnoot Resident
Those who have become regulars at WH are detrimental to SL in the sense that they are deterring the newbies themselves, with their mere presence. They haven't realized this, because they think they're the solution and that they can be useful enough to outdo their own negative/detrimental ways somehow.
Newbies are coming in and being strictly bullied around by either vigilantes who've taken it into their own hands to be the face of SL, welcoming newbies in all the wrong ways, or by the corrupt official helpers who're both driving them away enmasse.
At this point, I think they're right that newbies should come in on their own, away from these corrupt and misleading sources of drama/turmoil/ created by these social parasites who insist that their presence is necessary, even though it's just a charade, and that they're using the newbies like a personal resource, for their own personal satisfaction in some way. Whether it be the satisfaction of having someone naive to boss around or indoctrinate, or the delusion that they're actually being helpful by teaching someone a very narrow and outdated echo chamber-esqeue version of SL which only limits the newbies and prevents them from learning what SL really is.
" I've done this the wrong way for 20 years, so now I'm going to pass it down to you, little newbie. My way is the one true way , believe not in the flawed advise of the others."
But like I said, now they will have free reign to do all of this negativity on their freshly created alts, unchecked by the experienced veterans who would have called them out or brought them to the attention of the higher ups for abusing or misleading newbies if they had been present.
So how do you stop these parasitic vigilantes from making alts and doing what they've always done, from within the newbie zones?
Grim Hijinks
As someone who's gone to the hub since its launch I've witnessed troublemakers being dealt with rather swiftly should they ever appear. I don't know why we're acting as though Linden Labs can't police behaviour in their own official sim when they have been quite handily up until this point, yet a couple of visits from upper management and suddenly it becomes a problem, and subsequently a quarantine zone.
Deb Mercury
Midnoot Resident i think you judge us un fairly.
Midnoot Resident
Grim Hijinks Perhaps they see what I see ( doubtful), but it makes perfect sense to me now that I witness what has taken over the welcome hub. To allow the current dominating presences to remain is truly a fate worse than solitude. The problem is unaware of its own detrimental effect. Or intentionally avoiding the fact.
Saz Ninetails
By all means have new people start in a tutorial without all the distractions and alternative paths like there is now, but have that separate, have them complete a few tasks like we used to like learning how to control their avi by walking through something, the flying, jumping etc. Avoid the option to just run to the social hub and shout WHAT DO WE DO HERE and run off. Once they complete the basic assault course they go through a portal to the public social hub, they can redo parts of the tutorial or go out and mingle. Have the option for General or adult, so those who want to go explore adult activities as many seem to on landing, they can do so by choice. Those of us who want to "keep it G" can do so and not be harassed. We have suggested this to Lindens in person. Maybe a hybrid of the old version where you had a learning island then they got sent to a public area where residents could help them find their tribe. Social Island seems to just be a place for trolls lately, nobody speaks to the new arrivals just wants to show off their gestures and gadgets.
Deb Mercury
Saz Ninetails add to it that as part of basics that they learn to set up a profile and to commonly read those of people they want to interact with this would help save alot of tears .
Fauve Aeon
I’d like to know a little bit more information about why it was closed and if it is something temporary or going to be more permanent and what the plan for going forward is - the established helper community can reconvene on the public welcome area if this one is to be closed to returning/visiting residents, I think? I do remember that in some of the old first Rez places you also couldn’t return so perhaps this is a re-establishment of that protocol? Something that makes me uneasy is to see people jumping to conclusions when there isn’t any more information than there is currently about what has happened and why, but that’s just me. Not to be confused with people questioning it because obviously I’m here questioning it too. 😉
Saz Ninetails
Fauve Aeon last few days trying to go there said sorry you dont have access, now it says something like you can't go back to the welcome island you can go to the public welcome island to go over things again, but no clicky to send you there, its all a bit half done. Nobody has been informed of what is actually going on. Hence this thread, for some kind of clarity. <3
Fauve Aeon
Saz Ninetails, yep, I’m seeing you started the thread in that questing for answers vein and I hope we get some more info this coming week.
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