Mainland Prim to Mesh Upgrade Project & Linden Labs Museum of Prims.
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marxman1313 Resident
This is something I've been wanting to pitch for a long time but never really had the nerve to but here it goes.
SL has been around for a long time and is really old as far as the Internet is concerned. Because of this and due to it's nature as an ever growing/evolving creative sandbox has a lot of history as well as historical sites to it. One could even go so far as to say that there's a field of archeology to exploring it. But this creates a dilemma.
We're going on 20 plus years of evolution in 3d modeling, engine development, etc. And there are a lot of places with structures made of prims with many of them being very complicated and sophisticated builds and that's a LOT of land impact, plus rendering for anyone who wants to experience them or is just passing by. But on the other side of that same coin, it would be an absolute atrocity to just demolish them.
My proposed solution is that if possible, LDPW Moles take/are given a copy of these prim linksets (soft linked or hard) and using 3d modeling software clean the prims up before joining them to create a smaller number of mesh objects which are then used to create a new and near exact replica of the original that under most cases is lower land impact and easier to render. This can be done in Blender fairly easily although it is a tedious process and not as quick or efficient as creating an object from scratch inside said 3d modeling software, but it will retain effectively the same geometry with less vertices if not faces.
These linksets of mesh objects can then be used to replace the originals.This however would displace the originals, which is where the second step comes in: The Linden Labs Museum of Prims (Placeholder name).
This would be a series of sims if not a dedicated continent, be they full regions or homesteads that may or may not be a direct part of the mainland where the original prim creations would be moved to and displayed for their preservation and for their historical value to be retained.
Possible issues: Consent of the original creator of the objects or current owner of the land they reside on will likely be required. Ontop of this many of these people have likely left SL or are deceased.
Not every prim is going to be suitable for conversion, this is especially the case for "tortured" spheres, torus and similar. Likewise prims that have been tapered, path cut, hollowed, sheered etc will require some faces to be replace. And by nature of merging the prims into singular mesh objects the UVs will likely need to be redone. Physics models for these new mesh objects or linksets may also be problematic.
I know that this is not a small request and will raise some debates but I believe that it is something that should at the very least be taken into consideration if not possibly implemented in the future in some way shape or form for the continued optimization of Second Life for it's residences to further enjoy without completely disregarding the preservation of it's history.
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SarahKB7 Koskinen
There are already two large museums in Ritch region, one specific for general SL history, the other especially for notable SL objects.
AlettaMondragon Resident
marxman1313 Resident I'm not sure what exactly you would put into this new museum? There are several "prim museums", small and large, with many old items. Some of these would be gone now as their original owners are gone but LL keeps maintaining them. I know about some ancient places that could have been preserved in museum sims as you suggest but they're gone now. If the owner of such a build considers this and contributes their build to a museum it is a good idea, but otherwise I'm not so sure. There were some places that had been there for 10+ years when I was new and I liked them, and at some point they just vanished. In some cases it's best to let them go and others can build something new.
marxman1313 Resident
AlettaMondragon Resident The idea of the museum is to act as a place where the prim builds can exist for people to see them after they have been removed from their original locations and replaced with the prim to mesh conversation copy. Think of it like the prim build being relocated and replaced with a replica but the replica is easier on the viewer's computer.
AlettaMondragon Resident
marxman1313 Resident Oh okay, this was something that wasn't clear to me, thank you for explaining. It makes some sense, I suggested something similar when I asked LL to preserve Shareta Osumai, Cape Ekim and other important regions from Nascera, that they could be upgraded and moved to Bellisseria.
You can look at it here if you're interested:
There I had to realize not everyone would be happy if those old builds were "remeshed" or moved to Bellisseria.
The alternative right now is that the infohub regions are gone (hopefully LL has their offline versions saved), Cape Ekim and other regions that host quests are still running, but I must say I have little faith in that they will be preserved or that we would see Shareta Osumai and the other infohubs again. These regions would definitely deserve to be running at a museum estate. However, because of the quests that only make sense if you have to travel a little between each region, it would be really better to move them to Bellisseria.
Do you have any other places in mind that should go to such a museum?
marxman1313 Resident
AlettaMondragon Resident No problem, and a lotta stuff in Sansara Honestly. The Labyrinth in the Sea of Fables alongside that Greek style port town, Governor Linden's Mansion/Castle. The Leviathan in Ahab's Haunt, the S.S. Galaxy. All sorts of monuments and landmarks that are wonderful and detailed but made of prims. They deserve to be preserved and remembered but also need to be brought into the mesh era.
AlettaMondragon Resident
marxman1313 Resident Oh alright, your examples are consistent landmarks that are not supposed to go anywhere, though (the Galaxy has been moved around a few times over the years). Generally I agree with you that properly made mesh is more optimized than ancient prim builds, but the key is optimization.
If you look at just about anything throughout Bellisseria, you will see many unoptimized mesh items and it scales with size and complexity, meaning they are usually good at making small items that are good detail, low LI and visually pleasing, as well as usable as needed, but as you look at larger items, for example large willow trees, some decorations, and especially the largest buildings - Chippewa Town Hall in Chippewa Junction for example - you will see outstandingly high LI, irrational LOD geometry increasing LI while not providing good LOD visibility, not the best texture work to put it nicely, and often poorly made collision physics shapes - for example the railroad crossing devices blocking the sidewalks with their bulky convex hull physics shapes. Another thing the Moles usually do when creating mesh for Bellisseria is making models in one piece with too complex, concave geometry. Upon upload this concave geometry skyrockets LI. This is something many resident creators do as well, but in my experience not to such an alarming extent. (After all we're bound by having so much LI capacity to use, LL not so much.)
I don't think we should touch the Governor's mansion, Celebes or the Galaxy. If it ever became a question, like the Nascera infohubs, that they would be removed for whatever reason, then yes, they should be preserved. They are already being preserved as they are there, we can spend time at these places and remember how SL looked 20 years ago.
Jim Crisp
"Possible issues: Consent of the original creator of the objects or current owner of the land they reside on will likely be required. Ontop of this many of these people have likely left SL or are deceased."
Non-issues. According to the TOS, LL receives an unlimited, non-exclusive license to use all uploaded content.
marxman1313 Resident
Jim Crisp Consent would still be preferable. I'm not fond of the idea of taking 20 year old prim homes away from residents that have built them and used them for 20 years. That's just not right and would make the project extremely unpopular. I would absolutely hate it myself if they did that to people.
Jennifer Boyle
marxman1313 Resident I agree that consent is preferable where possible, but, as you pointed out, it may not be feasible in many cases.
Wicked Nightfall
There are large parts of the mainland that have been long forgotten and neglected by Linden Labs - their usual MO. We have a museum that dates back to 2010 and has never been updated - just wastes space. Parcels that were once used for employee homes sitting empty and unused. Huge Island parcels of empty land sitting unused with terrible prim trees.
Linden Labs should put those parcels up for auction so they can be used by the community rather than sitting abandoned and outdated.
Not everyone wants to pay LL to live in cookie cutter generic homes that look identical to your neighbors. Many of us appreciate creativity and individuality.
marxman1313 Resident
Wicked Nightfall The idea is to preserve that creativity from a time gone by while optimizing the mainland to be easier on users who wish to experience it without removing the option to experience the original creations themselves or lose the knowledge that these things were made prim by prim in world.
Oatmeal Linden
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Hello marxman1313! Thank you for the suggestion. The Content Creation team is currently engaged with other projects at the moment, but perhaps at some future point older Linden-owned builds may be updated and or preserved. We are already doing so with some of the legacy Linden Homes content and public areas, such as Cape Ekim.
Other public areas such as the original infohub at Ahern are maintained and repaired as needed, but are not likely to be altered significantly, as they do hold historical weight for our virtual world.
Thanks again for the suggestion!
marxman1313 Resident
Oatmeal Linden Thanks! And glad ya'll are already doing some things to preserve stuff. Hopefully things lighten up for ya'll soon.
AlettaMondragon Resident
Oatmeal Linden Will Shareta Osumai be reopened somewhere as well? Currently the original two regions and all of their copies are gone along with all the other original LH infohubs. Cape Ekim and some of the other regions involved in the quest are still running indeed. For now.