Re open Welcome Hub to all
Saz Ninetails
Limiting to mentors and those new to SL is liable to make more not stay. How it was until recently is they could benefit from meeting a wide range of well established citizens. It has always been down to more experienced people to help the new residents. Philip Linden has been there and speaking to a lot of us and now we are not welcome in the "welcome hub".
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Midnoot Resident
The only good thing that could come from this, is if LL were to read the overwhelming amount of examples of how having unofficial vigilantes, posing as the officials of welcome hub, as the officials of SL, is detrimental to the success of SL.
Then, in the future, insure that their officials are actually doing their job, justly, fairly, without bias and without petty nitpicking like we see today.
Radioactive Rosca
The access is now repoened to all residents. Please do keep it open and thanks all for your comments.
KiraYoichi Resident
This change is not needed. Due t9 only allowing mentors, Lindens, and new residents under a month old has been alot smoother to assist. I do agree, mentors are not always avaliable. Soon, a "pager" gadget will fix the problem. New residents will see the wider range of residents for sure.
Midnoot Resident
KiraYoichi Resident there was a pager button , a ' call mentor ' button , and at first , it was pretty useful as mentors would come pretty quickly . Now ? Or the last few times I saw a newbie press it ( which I admit was a while ago), nobody came. The welcome hub basically died off in comparison to what it was when it first started .
It would seem that even with their very lax requirements for becoming a mentor , that they were still unable to keep enough ( interested ) mentors to fill those dead hours when newbies press the button and nobody comes .
Midnoot Resident
Which , quite frankly , is still better than being aggressively confronted / interrogated by vigilantes who seem to have an agenda push down a newborns throat , rather than simply giving them direct and concise assistance .
I even recall multiple times where the vigilantes would lace their replies to the newbies with long winded speeches about how SL isn't a place to do anything other than what that specific vigilante thought of as acceptable ( despite it being completely untrue ) . By the time they finally get to the answer the newbie was looking for , newbie is already bored and repulsed by the sudden ideology lecture that nobody asked for , disinterested and ready to log out . 😔
Midnoot Resident
Talk about being detrimental to the success of second life . Basically turning away interested customers by shattering their dreams of using SL in the way they see fit , in the way they they had been lead to believe SL was capable of from word of mouth , SL's reputation, etc.
Nothing screams ' helpful ' like being the enemy from within , and slowly decreasing the population of SL, one newbie at a time .
That is the threat of having non officials in the welcome hub , posing as the officials .
Radioactive Rosca
Midnoot Resident: What prevents the "vigilantes" from creating a new account and continuing their schemes on the Welcome HUB with this new account? Meanwhile, those who went to the HUB to help, even if they weren't Official Mentors, won't do that...
Midnoot Resident
Radioactive Rosca good point . I've mentioned that this is one of my only concerns now . But realistically , the majority of people who prey on newbies are using older accounts , because they wanna use all of the resources they've accumulated over the years on those accounts. Including friend lists and reputations and groups . Those who fly under the radar , are typically older accounts , masquerading as an oh so helpful , oh so trustworthy , helping hand.
I think by banning the non officials , you eliminate a huge portion of the predators. Now you just have to worry about those who are willing to go through the effort of creating alts specifically designed for newbie hunting , and you'll have to rely on the officials to stop them . And that's where the trouble starts , because as I also mentioned previously , LL simply isn't willing to have this kind of vigilant and professional moderation , as proven by going 23 years without it .
Idk how to deal with the alt predators other than by having actual professionals to spot them . I notice there are many ... Many things that slip past the eye of the average mentor as it stands now ( because they're just average citizens with a miniscule understanding of SL themselves half of the time 🤣), Including those amongst their own ranks who absolutely should not be there , so it's not like this will be an easy task .
But it's not like there were any non officials out there spotting these people either . Slipped right past their eyes as well, so there truly never was a line of defense against such a situation , despite the argument I can see being used to keep non officials around .
Maybe in sheer volume of people present , alone , you will be able to eliminate some of the alt predators , but it cancels itself out by allowing the non-alt predators to remain present on their ' respected , trusted , and ever so privileged , main accounts which have access to the kingdom's back door .
KiraYoichi Resident
Midnoot Resident Yes, I also have the pager hud to this day. I was suprised it was removed. Their working on a update(so ive heard) to improve the pager.
steph Arnott
Midnoot Resident, what, you are just ranting nonsense. It is people like you repeating the same old rubbish about decreasing population when it has increased.
Midnoot Resident
steph Arnott Sir... Lol.. did you say the SL population has increased?... Do we really need to look at how the login numbers, despite being filled with bots and alts, have dropped from 80,000 to 60,000, to 40,000 and current day, barely 30,000? Do we...really?
But that's not what this is about. This is about allowing the predators who prey on our newbie population, disguised as 'a helping hand', disguised as an ' experienced and knowledgeable player', someone a newbie might look up to, etc, to take advantage advantage of and drive away countless newbies , as they force their agendas, ideologies , bias, etc, on the poor newbies before they've even had a chance to learn about SL.
I can only hope that LL pays attention and removes said imposters from the bunch, but there will always be more, and that's a shame. But the fact that some can survive for decades, going undetected by LL , because LL isn't looking closely enough, is even more of a shame.
I just hate to think of all of the newbies that have been turned away from SL after being used in the 'harvesting process' of these disguised 'recruiters', 'cult like following hunters', 'literal waifu hunters', and seekers of 'lost puppies'.
Or even worse... Newbies that have been turned away, repulsed from SL by the presence of power trippers who only became mentors or unofficial helpers to gain a sense of authority, to feel a part of something, yet never had any desire to 'help' people, so to speak.
steph Arnott
Midnoot Resident, trading on the market place is all that is needed to crush your claims. Also premium membership is increasing and seeing as you are not on SL 24/7 you clearly have not figured out yet that SL is worldwide and not just USA which seems to think it is the center of the galaxy.
Midnoot Resident
Perhaps when a newbie has a wardrobe malfunction, they will have time to remain calm and figure out how to fix it, rather than immediately being tackled from 3 different vigilante players who refuse to give them time to even comprehend what's going on before screaming at the top of their lungs that the newbie MUST remove themselves from the premises , or fix their problem IMMEDIATELY! .
I'm just saying, the things i've seen non officials do to newbies ( Like the above example) are truly unacceptable and if I were a newbie and had to experience such a hostile 'entrance' to Second Life, I'd probably never return. Where as, if I had been left alone, and allowed to learn everything on my own time, without being treated like some kind of criminal just because I accidentally replaced outfit and became naked or something, it would be a more favorable memory of SL.
Saz Ninetails
My apologies to anyone who has been upset by comments made on this thread. I am disgusted how it has been hijacked with some frankly bizarre accusations. Maybe this is a reflection of the posters intent themselves. No idea who these mysterious bogeymen are and also a lot of "I havent been to the welcome hub for 2 years but I know exactly what is going on there" which seems contradictory. I am sorry that the good mentors and Moles have been abused. I am good friends with many of them and they just want to help new residents get settled to keep the community going. Lets ignore the naysayers who have been claiming SL is dying since at least 10 years ago.
Deb Mercury
Saz Ninetails the ol if they havent been how would they know, i agree they actually dont. i havent been in a week and i dont have a clue what is being done . i just hope all will be ok in the end.
Midnoot Resident
Saz Ninetails Lol. I didn't say I didn't still go to the surrounding sims. I just avoided the 'helper' area, since it has become stagnated with a very unwelcoming group of individuals who had taken it apon themselves to become the unofficial mentors of SL. Oh, and because the officials made it very clear, long ago, that they did not appreciate loitering of non-mentors. See? I'm a good rule follower and I take the hint. But others needed to be literally locked out to get the hint.
And believe me, after the first 6 months to a year of being at the welcome hub, the patterns were set in stone. So it's not like the cliques of unwelcoming regulars who seem to inhabit the welcome hub every day of their lives, as if literally moving into it, had changed or been exiled, or anything like that. It's not like I didn't see the same names from 200 meters away every single time I teleported into the surrounding sims or anything, solidifying my claims or anything like that.
My only fear is that this is just a temporary fix, instead of the much needed permanent fix that will finally give the newbies some room to breathe, without interference from unofficials :P
steph Arnott
Saz Ninetails, lol, SL was dying until about three years ago when the removed asset stripping management was in charge. The constant ''sl is dying'' ''sl numbers are going down like a lead balloon'' tosh was years ago and still those who left keep spreading the bull.
Chrisje Lane
I guess the same people who make 100 accounts for a game within SL, or 36+ accounts to raid lucky chairs, will still be able to 'get to newbies' if they actually want to.
Midnoot Resident
Chrisje Lane As it is now, or was, before the banning of oldbies, they would have zero hoops to jump through and could bring in their cliques and friend groups that they've gathered on their old accounts over the years, without shame of loitering the newbie zone on some freshly created noob alt. Now, it will at least be something that they're forced to do in secrecy, unable to bring in their entire clique of same-minded-echo-chamber-buddies to demolish the overall vibe of the welcome hub (as they do now, or did). Can't really be like " Alright, are we switching to our 'hang out in the welcome hub group of alts', guys? :D". I mean they can, but less likely. So it really is a huge deterrent to one of the most consistent problems the WH has now, which is those groups who literally move in and live in WH and create an unwelcoming environment (whether they intended to or not, they 100% are).
Now you'll just have to worry about when they re-allow access to the unprofessional mentors who will have free reign, behind the scenes, without any veterans to detect wrong doing.
Chrisje Lane
Midnoot Resident I also remember why the mentorship was once abolished... "something about a copybotting scandal with mentors being heavily involved". I hope they set a better example for newbies nowadays.
jackiewallace Resident
I understand the frustration, but I actually support Linden Lab’s decision. The very first days in Second Life are crucial, and new residents do need a safe, focused environment where they can receive clear guidance without being overwhelmed or approached by people who are looking for something completely different.
For many newcomers, their first interactions can define whether they stay or leave. If those interactions are confusing, intrusive, or inappropriate, they’re far more likely to give up.
A dedicated Welcome Hub that prioritizes mentors and brand-new residents helps ensure that people receive proper information, respectful support, and a calm space to learn the basics.
There will still be plenty of opportunities later to meet the wider community - but the first steps should be safe, structured, and genuinely helpful.
It’s not the entire Welcome Hub that’s restricted - only one region out of the many. So new users can still move freely around the Welcome Hub and interact with older residents if they want to.
Teresa Firelight
Given the hostility in some of the replies, maybe the newcomers are safer with the area being closed. A shame really, as people who make friends with others of common interests are more likely to keep coming back. I hate to see it close but having read some of the heated replies, I am beginning to think that was a wise step on LL's part.
So I do NOT vote for reopening it at this time.
Midnoot Resident
Teresa Firelight I agree that it shouldn't be opened , but it seems for a different reason than yourself , and let's be honest, any hostility said in this entire thread so far , has been directed at the poor execution and moderation of the welcome hub . It's directly targeting their unwillingness to properly moderate the welcome hub , so instead , they choose to blanket punish everyone by barring access to everyone . Or at the unprofessionalism and blatant laziness of ( not all, but common enough for multiple people to agree on ) mentors .
I myself haven't been to welcome hub in a long time ( at least not the newbies area ) , because they killed welcome hub off over 1.5 years ago and it has been a desolate wasteland ever since , except for when the stagnated pond of unintentionally detrimental ( or willingly. Who knows ?) regulars are occupying the sim and using it as their own recruitment / personal support / hunting grounds / etc . So hopefully the fear isn't that innocent ol' ,absent, Midnoot would be any concern to keep the welcome hub closed . Lolol
I hate to even promote moderation in second life , because from more than 2 decades of repeatedly witnessing the same vicious cycle of unjust , bias , and straight up unprofessional non officials absolutely power tripping sims into the ground ( like wh was done at one point ), I know it never goes well even if they do seem strict. But it's still better than straight up barring access to the masses . I just wish they would look deeper than surface level and pluck the truly detrimental out of the bunch . Problem is , of course , as proven by this very topic , that that too will be misinterpreted and used as fuel , against the innocent.
Maddie Margulis
Lots of passionate responses! We all want SL to be a happy place, including our Welcome Hub. The changes have only happened a few days ago and part of that was weekend, we don't know if it's permanent (my guess is no), we don't know if there are external stakeholders whose requirements need to be taken into account requiring changes, we don't know if things are currently in a holding pattern until some things get worked out, we just don't know. Please save your distress until after we know for sure what's happening. Take my advice, I'm not using it (That was a joke, I was worried initially but Viola talked me down). In my many years of volunteering in various places to help newcomers, the negative helpers have always been a small minority - and I do know that any in our WH team are very quickly removed. Anybody with specific Welcome Hub incidents to discuss can contact Viola Mole.
Deb Mercury
Maddie Margulis i stay in touch with viola i know she is busy so i dont pester to much she is just as stress as some are but know this i love all you moles and mentors and i know beyond any doubt its not your decision. and i feel this is a measure to remove all bad elements in welcome hub hence the term fumigation. i think it fits in a humorous way. and what ever happenes i am here to help hugs
Ebony Rabbit
Nah. They just need to rename it the Unwelcome Hub. And rename the Social Plaza the Antisocial Plaza.
Midnoot Resident
Ebony Rabbit It was only social in the beginning , before the usual power trippers caught on and signed up to become mentors , before the usual vigilantes who volunteer in all the other sims, caught on and brought the same problems with them, etc... But for some reason, LL refuses to catch onto who these people are and continues to allow them to weasel into every single group that's supposed to be welcoming and helpful, until they eventually become THE face of SL; a very antisocial, unwelcoming, noob deterring face at that.
But it's not because of this lazy bandaid fix they've come up with recently, which is the mass exile of oldbies. That's not even what made it unwelcoming, in fact, it may be the only solution to the damage that the residents themselves have done/
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